SPEAKERS CONTENTS INSERTS
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2003
RECOGNIZING THE CONTINUED IMPORTANCE OF THE TRANSATLANTIC RELATIONSHIP AND PROMOTING STRONGER RELATIONS WITH EUROPE BY REAFFIRMING THE NEED FOR A CONTINUED AND MEANINGFUL DIALOGUE BETWEEN THE UNITED STATES AND EUROPE
MARKUP
BEFORE THE
SUBCOMMITTEE ON EUROPE
OF THE
COMMITTEE ON
INTERNATIONAL RELATIONS
HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
ONE HUNDRED EIGHTH CONGRESS
FIRST SESSION
ON
H. Res. 390
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OCTOBER 29, 2003
Serial No. 108–55
Printed for the use of the Committee on International Relations
Available via the World Wide Web: http://www.house.gov/international—relations
COMMITTEE ON INTERNATIONAL RELATIONS
HENRY J. HYDE, Illinois, Chairman
JAMES A. LEACH, Iowa
DOUG BEREUTER, Nebraska
CHRISTOPHER H. SMITH, New Jersey,
Vice Chairman
DAN BURTON, Indiana
ELTON GALLEGLY, California
ILEANA ROS-LEHTINEN, Florida
CASS BALLENGER, North Carolina
DANA ROHRABACHER, California
EDWARD R. ROYCE, California
PETER T. KING, New York
STEVE CHABOT, Ohio
AMO HOUGHTON, New York
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JOHN M. McHUGH, New York
THOMAS G. TANCREDO, Colorado
RON PAUL, Texas
NICK SMITH, Michigan
JOSEPH R. PITTS, Pennsylvania
JEFF FLAKE, Arizona
JO ANN DAVIS, Virginia
MARK GREEN, Wisconsin
JERRY WELLER, Illinois
MIKE PENCE, Indiana
THADDEUS G. McCOTTER, Michigan
WILLIAM J. JANKLOW, South Dakota
KATHERINE HARRIS, Florida
TOM LANTOS, California
HOWARD L. BERMAN, California
GARY L. ACKERMAN, New York
ENI F.H. FALEOMAVAEGA, American Samoa
DONALD M. PAYNE, New Jersey
ROBERT MENENDEZ, New Jersey
SHERROD BROWN, Ohio
BRAD SHERMAN, California
ROBERT WEXLER, Florida
ELIOT L. ENGEL, New York
WILLIAM D. DELAHUNT, Massachusetts
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GREGORY W. MEEKS, New York
BARBARA LEE, California
JOSEPH CROWLEY, New York
JOSEPH M. HOEFFEL, Pennsylvania
EARL BLUMENAUER, Oregon
SHELLEY BERKLEY, Nevada
GRACE F. NAPOLITANO, California
ADAM B. SCHIFF, California
DIANE E. WATSON, California
ADAM SMITH, Washington
BETTY McCOLLUM, Minnesota
CHRIS BELL, Texas
THOMAS E. MOONEY, SR., Staff Director/General Counsel
ROBERT R. KING, Democratic Staff Director
Subcommittee on Europe
DOUG BEREUTER, Nebraska, Chairman
DAN BURTON, Indiana
ELTON GALLEGLY, California
PETER T. KING, New York
JO ANN DAVIS, Virginia
THADDEUS G. McCOTTER, Michigan
WILLIAM J. JANKLOW, South Dakota
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ROBERT WEXLER, Florida
ELIOT L. ENGEL, New York
WILLIAM D. DELAHUNT, Massachusetts
BARBARA LEE, California
JOSEPH M. HOEFFEL, Pennsylvania
EARL BLUMENAUER, Oregon
VINCE MORELLI, Subcommittee Staff Director
PATRICK PRISCO, Professional Staff Member
JONATHAN KATZ, Democratic Professional Staff Member
BEVERLY HALLOCK, Staff Associate
C O N T E N T S
MARKUP OF:
H. Res. 390, Recognizing the continued importance of the transatlantic relationship and promoting stronger relations with Europe by reaffirming the need for a continued and meaningful dialogue between the United States and Europe
LETTERS, STATEMENTS, ETC., SUBMITTED FOR THE RECORD
The Honorable Doug Bereuter, a Representative in Congress from the State of Nebraska, and Chairman, Subcommittee on Europe: Prepared statement
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The Honorable Robert Wexler, a Representative in Congress from the State of Florida: Prepared statement
RECOGNIZING THE CONTINUED IMPORTANCE OF THE TRANSATLANTIC RELATIONSHIP AND PROMOTING STRONGER RELATIONS WITH EUROPE BY REAFFIRMING THE NEED FOR A CONTINUED AND MEANINGFUL DIALOGUE BETWEEN THE UNITED STATES AND EUROPE
WEDNESDAY, OCTOBER 29, 2003
House of Representatives,
Subcommittee on Europe,
Committee on International Relations,
Washington, DC.
The Subcommittee met, pursuant to call, at 1 p.m. In Room 2200 Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Doug Bereuter [Chairman of the Subcommittee] presiding.
Mr. BEREUTER. Pursuant to notice, I call up resolution H. Res. 390 for purposes of markup.
[H. Res. 390 follows:]
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Mr. BEREUTER. Without objection, the resolution will be considered as read and open for amendment at any point. I have a relatively brief opening statement on the issue.
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Today, the Europe Subcommittee will mark up H. Res. 390 which recognizes the continued importance of transatlantic relations. As the author of the resolution, I am pleased to be joined by the Ranking Democrat, Mr. Wexler, the Ranking Democrat of the full International Relations Committee, Mr. Lantos, and the Vice Chairwoman of the Subcommittee, Mrs. Davis, as cosponsors.
In June, this Subcommittee, in the wake of the difficult debate over Iraq, held two hearings on the future of transatlantic relations. During the entire period of debate over Iraq, we read and heard all manner of doomsayers pronouncing the end of transatlantic relations and beginning the new, more contentious era in U.S.-European relations.
However, at these hearings, in which we received testimony from both American and European experts, we heard that by any measure, the relationship between the United States and the nations of Europe, ''old or new,'' was certainly among the most important foreign relationships of the United States.
No two regions in the world share a history, a common set of values and a global vision as much as do the United States and Europe. For the most part, our traditional and closest allies are in Europe. In Europe, our core national interests are fully engaged. Our trillion dollar economy, our multibillion dollar system of trade and our security are integrally linked with European continent. With our European partners, we share a wider range of interests and higher level of cooperation on issues than with any other region in the world, despite our occasional differences.
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According to all the witnesses who testified in June, I believe, the time was right to put the debate over the Iraq War behind us and to begin to energetically consider how to re-energize the transatlantic relationship in a positive manner which is forward-looking and which focuses on developing common strategies to address common challenges.
In a recent speech to the NATO Parliamentary Assembly, this Member observed that the Iraq dispute really was not at all a straight-forward dispute between Europe and the United States. Europe was, in fact, split. As we know, the debate centered on the four nations which opposed the war against Iraq, but the debate almost totally ignored the other 18 nations of Europe which joined in support for the U.S. policy toward the regime of Saddam Hussein.
Nevertheless, the harsh rhetoric which we heard on both sides of the Atlantic did, in varying degrees, damage the overall relationship between America and some European countries. The American public felt deep disappointment, frustration, and anger. This anger has abated but has not disappeared in its effect.
The controversy also did some damage to the reputations of the United Nations Security Council, NATO and the European Union, especially to the latter's Common Foreign and Security Policy, in which, according to many European leaders, France and Germany hoped to dominate.
The resolution we are considering today was developed as a result of those hearings. The measure recognizes the continued importance of the transatlantic relationship and affirms the conviction that the relationship is too important and too strongly developed to allow policy disagreements, such as the one over Iraq, to significantly disrupt it.
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In addition, the resolution reaffirms the visibility of transatlantic security.
And finally, H. Res. 390 urges enhanced efforts to develop stronger relationships with our friends and allies in Europe through enhanced dialogue and communication between this nation and Europe, especially through such mechanisms as the various formal and informal interparliamentary organizations which we have here in the Congress, such as the NATO Parliamentary Assembly, the Transatlantic Legislators' Dialogue and the OSCE Parliamentary Assembly.
I urge my colleagues to adopt the resolution, and I yield such time as you may consume to the gentleman from Florida, Mr. Wexler.
[The prepared statement of Mr. Bereuter follows:]
PREPARED STATEMENT OF THE HONORABLE DOUG BEREUTER, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF NEBRASKA, AND CHAIRMAN, SUBCOMMITTEE ON EUROPE
Today the Europe Subcommittee will mark up H.Res. 390 which recognizes the continued importance of transatlantic relations.
As the author of this resolution, I am pleased to be joined by our Ranking Democrat, Mr. Wexler, the Ranking Democrat of the full International Relations Committee, Mr. Lantos and the Vice Chairwomen of the Subcommittee, Ms. Davis as original sponsors.
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In June, this Subcommittee, in the wake of the difficult debate over Iraq, held two hearings on the future of transatlantic relations. During the entire period of debate over Iraq, we read and heard all manner of doomssayers pronouncing the end of transatlantic relations and the beginning of a new, more contentious era in U.S.-European relations.
However, at these hearings, in which we received testimony from both American and European experts, we heard that by any measure, the relationship between the United States and the nations of Europe, ''old or new,'' was certainly among the most important foreign relationship of the United States.
No two regions in the world share a history, a common set of values and a global vision as much as do the United States and Europe. For the most part our traditional and closest allies are in Europe. In Europe our core national interests are fully engaged. Our trillion dollar economy, our multi-billion dollar system of trade and our security are integrally linked with the European continent. With our European partners we share a wider range of interests and a higher level of cooperation on issues than with any other region in the world despite our occasional differences.
According to all of the witnesses who testified in June, the time was right to put the debate over the Iraq war behind us and to begin to energetically consider how to re-energize the transatlantic relationship in a positive manner which is forward-looking and which focuses on developing common strategies to address common challenges.
In a recent speech to the NATO Parliamentary Assembly, this Member observed that the Iraq dispute, really was not at all a straight-forward dispute between Europe and the United States. Europe was in fact split. As we know, the debate centered on the four nations which opposed war against Iraq. But the debate almost totally ignored the other eighteen nations of Europe which joined in support for the U.S. policy toward the regime of Saddam Hussein.
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Nevertheless, the harsh rhetoric which we heard on both sides of the Atlantic did, in varying degrees, damage the overall relationship between America and some European nations. The American public felt deep disappointment, frustration and anger with several European nations, including France and Germany. This anger has abated but has not disappeared in its effect.
The controversy also did some damage to the reputations of the U.N. Security Council, NATO and the European Union, especially to the latter's Common Foreign and Security Policy in which, according to many European leaders, France and Germany hoped to dominate.
The resolution we are considering today was developed as a result of those hearings. The measure recognizes the continued importance of the transatlantic relationship and affirms the conviction that the relationship is too important and too strongly developed to allow policy disagreements such as the one over Iraq, to significantly disrupt it.
In addition, the resolution reaffirms the indivisibility of transatlantic security.
And finally, H.Res. 390 urges enhanced efforts to develop stronger relations with our friends and allies in Europe through enhanced dialogue and communication between this nation and Europe especially through such mechanisms as the various formal and informal inter-parliamentary organizations which we have here in the Congress, such as the NATO Parliamentary Assembly, the Transatlantic Legislators' Dialogue, and the OSCE Parliamentary Assembly.
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I urge my Colleagues to adopt this resolution.
Mr. WEXLER. Thank you, Chairman Bereuter.
I want to thank you especially for introducing this resolution, and I share your strong belief that there is no more important economic, military and political relationship to the United States during these dangerous and trying times than our transatlantic relationship to Europe.
The resolution before the Subcommittee expresses the need for renewed and meaningful dialogue across the Atlantic as we work in concert to address the short- and long-term threats of the proliferation of mass destruction and global terrorism. I hope passage of this resolution will help mend tattered transatlantic relations, which have moved beyond heated rhetoric in recent weeks and resulted in substantive progress on the ground, including greater U.S.-European cooperation in rebuilding Iraq and Afghanistan.
This resolution also highlights the undeniable fact that the present and future of America and Europe are intrinsically interwoven and cannot be separated without grave consequence to either side.
Finally, it is a reminder of the historic partnership resulting in a multitrillion-dollar trade relationship and cooperation in the promotion of human rights, global health, democracy, counterterrorism and intelligence.
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Last February, Germany and the Netherlands assumed control of the International Security Assistance Force from Turkey, where they remain in joint command of the peacekeeping force in Kabul. I strongly believe it is in the transatlantic community's best interest to work jointly through organizations such as NATO, which has expanded its scope beyond the Cold War mandate and engaged in a new theater of operation in the ''Greater Middle East.''
I also welcome the recent inauguration in the Netherlands of the new NATO Response Force. According to our Ambassador to NATO, Mr. Burns,
''The NATO Response Force is an important new military capability for NATO and further evidence of NATO's ongoing transformation to meet the new threats from global terrorism.''
Mr. Chairman, I would like to offer a word of caution to our European allies that while most Americans support the strengthening of the European Union and the formation of European Security and Defense Policy, believing it is in the best security and economic interest of our Nation, there are many in Washington who are concerned that the construction of these new European institutions, especially the European Security and Defense Policy aspect, are being established as a counterweight to America and NATO.
I strongly believe a European defense capability, including a recent plan by France, Germany, Belgium, and Luxembourg to create a new military headquarters, however, goes beyond the scope of Berlin Plus and will severely strain transatlantic relations and possibly lead to the dismantling of NATO as we know it. Our European allies must work very closely with us to close the capabilities gap in terms of defense spending between us and them. We spent roughly $376 billion in 2003, compared with $140 billion spent by the 18 NATO allies.
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Despite forward momentum and growing transatlantic cooperation at the recent Madrid Donors Conference, in the United Nations Security Council and in dealing with the threat of Iran, there remains a deep rift that cannot be ignored. We would be doing us and Europeans a great disservice if we did not evaluate the policy divergences that took place over Iraq and take appropriate steps to make certain that the two most important actors on the world stage worked together in concert, not in opposition.
Mr. Chairman, it is critical that Europe accept the realities of a post-Saddam Iraq and the potential for transformation in the ''Greater Middle East.'' At the same time, the Bush Administration, which has definitely managed to turn most of Europe against America, must understand that military power alone is not necessarily a panacea to guaranteeing our security, fighting terror or halting the proliferation of mass destruction.
Ultimately this cannot be achieved without the assistance of our allies in Europe and throughout the world. It is this message of friendship, understanding and cooperation that I hope will lay the future of transatlantic ties.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for pursuing this resolution.
[The prepared statement of Mr. Wexler follows:]
PREPARED STATEMENT OF THE HONORABLE ROBERT WEXLER, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF FLORIDA
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Chairman Bereuter, I want to thank you for introducing this resolution and share your strong belief that there is no more important economic, military and political relationship to the United States during these dangerous and trying times than our Transatlantic relationship with Europe.
The resolution before the subcommittee expresses the need for renewed and meaningful dialogue across the Atlantic as we work in concert to address the short and long-term threats of the proliferation of weapons of mass destruction and global terrorism. I hope passage of this resolution will help mend tattered Transatlantic relations, which have moved beyond heated rhetoric in recent weeks and resulted in substantive progress on the ground, including greater U.S.-European cooperation in rebuilding Iraq and Afghanistan. This resolution also highlights the undeniable fact that the present and future of America and Europe are intrinsically interwoven and cannot be separated without grave consequence to either side. Finally, it is a reminder of the historic partnership resulting in a multi-trillion dollar trade relationship and cooperation in the promotion of human rights, global health, democracy, counter-terrorism and intelligence.
Since 9/11, America has worked shoulder-to-shoulder with our European allies to paralyze financial conduits funding terror and arrest Al Qaeda operatives, while also collaborating on a variety of levels to prevent future attacks. Last February, Germany and the Netherlands assumed control of the International Security Assistance Force (ISAF) from Turkey, where they remain in joint command of the peacekeeping force in Kabul. I strongly believe it is in the Transatlantic communities' best interest to work jointly through organizations, such as NATO, which has expanded its scope beyond its Cold War mandate and engaged in a new theater of operation in the ''Greater Middle East.'' I also welcome the recent inauguration in the Netherlands of the new NATO Response Force. According to American Ambassador to NATO Nicholas Burns, '' The NATO Response Force is an important, innovative new military capability for NATO, and further evidence of NATO's on-going transformation to meet the new threats from global terrorism.''
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Like Chairman Bereuter, I would like to offer a word of caution to our European allies that while most Americans support the strengthening of the European Union and the formation of European Security and Defense Policy (ESDP)—believing it is in the best security and economic interest of our nation—there are many in Washington who are concerned that the construction of these new European institutions, especially ESDP, are being established as a counterweight to America and NATO. I strongly believe a European defense capability, including a recent plan by France, Germany, Belgium and Luxembourg to create a new European Union military headquarters, that goes beyond the scope of Berlin Plus would severely strain Transatlantic relations and possibly lead to the dismantling of NATO as we know it. In addition, our European allies must close the massive capabilities gap in defense spending between the United States and Europe—the U.S. defense budget reached $376 billion in 2003 compared to $140 billion spread between 18 NATO allies.
Despite forward momentum and growing transatlantic cooperation at the recent Madrid Donors Conference, in the United Nations Security Council and in dealing with the threat of Iran, there remains a deep rift that cannot be ignored. We would be doing Americans and Europeans a great disservice if we did not evaluate the policy divergences that took place during the debate over Iraq and take appropriate steps to make certain that the two most important actors on the world stage are joined together in concert, not opposition.
Mr. Chairman, it is critical that Europe accept the realities of a post-Saddam Iraq and the potential for transformation in the ''Greater Middle East.'' At the same time, the Bush Administration, which has deftly managed to turn most of Europe against America, must understand that military power alone is not necessarily a panacea to guaranteeing our security, fighting terror or halting the proliferation of weapons of mass destruction. Ultimately, these goals cannot be achieved without the assistance of our allies in Europe and throughout the world. It is this message of friendship, understanding and cooperation that I hope will lay the future of transatlantic ties.
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Mr. BEREUTER. Thank you, Mr. Wexler.
I appreciate the fact that you pointed out the establishment of a separate headquarters for ESDP is in violation of the Berlin Plus agreement which was unanimously agreed to.
Are there further opening statements?
Mrs. Davis.
Mrs. DAVIS. Thank you.
Mr. Chairman, I support H. Res. 390 and wish to commend you for bringing this measure before the Subcommittee at this time.
The recent debate over Iraq was a particularly difficult time for overall transatlantic relations. Although, as you correctly stated, this dispute was with four nations in particular and not the whole of Europe, France and Germany are important friends and allies, and it was particularly frustrating that we were having such a disagreement with them.
Now, however, it is time to move on. We must work to reestablish the kind of strong transatlantic relation with all of Europe which is required for us to deal effectively with those international issues which affect us on both sides of the Atlantic. As the resolution correctly states, the transatlantic relationship is much too important to allow issues such as Iraq, however difficult, to result in both us and Europe drifting apart.
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As Chair of the U.S. delegation of the Transatlantic Legislators' Dialogue, I am especially pleased that the resolution mentions the importance of this organization and the dialogue the TLD promotes with counterparts in the European Parliament. As you know, in July we had a very successful meeting of the TLD. During that meeting, both delegations pledged to strengthening the transatlantic partnership by renewing our pursuit of common values such as democracy, human rights and open markets and societies and by reinforcing interparliamentary contacts through mechanisms such as additional exchanges and video-conferencing. We also agreed to try to enhance the effectiveness of our operations by establishing new consultative mechanisms which would serve as an ''early-warning system'' which would allow intensified dialogue on possible contentious issues at early stages of the legislative process.
In just 3 weeks, our colleagues from the Parliament will be coming to the United States to continue this discussion. I believe we all understand and appreciate the importance of this dialogue and the need to continue to support stronger relations with Europe and its Union through mechanisms such as these.
Again, Mr. Chairman, I want to thank you for your efforts on behalf of transatlantic relations and for your support for interparliamentary dialogue.
I urge passage of this resolution.
Mr. BEREUTER. Thank you very much, Mrs. Davis.
It is the lack of food that is getting to you, and I am responsible for it.
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I appreciate the leadership that you bring to the Transatlantic Legislators' Dialogue, which is a longstanding effort which was formerly known as the U.S.–E.U. Parliamentary Exchange.
We have an interesting challenge before us. Mr. Amo Houghton, my dear colleague, has invited Members to join a caucus that he is taking leadership on. It is the Congressional Caucus on France. And I had the pleasure to introduce him to Pierre Lellouche, who is here today, a member of the French National Assembly, who is the co-Chairman of the U.S. Friendship Group in the French Assembly. They are looking forward to meeting on a routine basis if that is possible.
Are there further opening statements?
Mr. Delahunt.
Mr. DELAHUNT. I do not have an opening statement, Mr. Chairman, but I decided to make some observations.
Mr. BEREUTER. Please do.
Mr. DELAHUNT. I am reminded of that childhood taunt of ''Sticks and stones will break my bones, but words will never hurt me.''
Well, I think what we have all observed and should take notice of, in the course of the past 6 months to a year, while the debate on Iraq has raged within this country as well as internationally, words do have consequences, serious consequences; and I really want to applaud you. Let me also acknowledge Mrs. Davis for her efforts in terms of attempting to abate what, if left unattended, could be a deteriorating situation between ourselves and our traditional allies, ones with whom we have had differences, ones with whom we have had moments of vigorous debate. But that is, I would suggest, the essence of democracy. We have it here every day.
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You and the Ranking Member speak of Europe being divided. Well, we were divided here. In fact, the majority of the Democratic Caucus voted against the resolution authorizing the President to intervene militarily in Iraq. I think we all, both here domestically as well as internationally, have to look forward; and we can only do that, I suggest, if we are sincere and genuine about where we are going and how we get there in a way that is based on neutral respect.
I am proud to sign on as a cosponsor to this resolution———
Mr. BEREUTER. Okay.
Mr. DELAHUNT [continuing]. And want to thank you for your efforts, in terms of, while acknowledging the differences, trying to get us out of this quagmire of finger-pointing and reducing ourselves, I think, to a level where that childhood taunt becomes a benchmark.
Mr. BEREUTER. Thank you, Mr. Delahunt, for your thoughtful comments, and I appreciate your kind words for Mrs. Davis and myself.
The last 2 days, three of our colleagues, a bipartisan group, plus myself were in Ottawa; and as you may remember, my counterpart, a Canadian, to the NATO Parliamentary Assembly had some very sharp words to say, which she thought were off-microphone, and so did a Minister in the Canadian Government. But the two Speakers invited our delegation to come up and spend 2 days with them, the Speaker of the House of Commons and the Speaker of the Canadian senate; and it was most productive. And while they did not support our military action in Iraq, they are assisting today in rebuilding; and as a matter of fact, in Afghanistan they have, on a per capita basis, the largest contribution.
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So I think that kind of interparliamentary dialogue can oftentimes bring a more tolerant discussion. That was the case in the Parliamentary Assembly which I participated in, in contrast to the Security Council and to the North Atlantic Council and within NATO itself.
I think the fact that we know each other fairly well for a period of time, that does lead us to understand the other's position or at least to accept it tolerantly in most cases.
Are there other opening statements?
The gentleman from South Dakota, Mr. Janklow.
Mr. JANKLOW. Mr. Chairman, I do not have a statement, but I have just a brief comment.
Mr. BEREUTER. You are recognized.
Mr. JANKLOW. Thank you.
You know, sometimes I think that Iraq is more of a symptom of the problem in our relationships than the substance of them, when we deal with some of these other countries.
When you look at that map over there on the wall, you look at this country, and recognizing what an incredible melting pot we are, a huge amount, a huge amount of our historical immigration and culture comes from what we call ''Europe,'' a lot of different countries. We have a tendency at times to take an isolated country or two in Europe and call them ''Europe,'' as opposed to dealing with them or thinking of them on an individual basis.
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I think it is just what you said, Mr. Chairman, with respect to your recent visit to Canada. I heard a person say a long time ago, ''Countries do not have permanent relationships; they have permanent interests,'' and I think more and more we see that come into play in this complex world that we live in.
We talk about violation of the Berlin Plus with the FTC, but the reality of the situation is, it is going to move forward. People that have gone through all the effort of putting together to plan publicly announcing on it and a decision having been made, but it is going to go forward, irrespective of whether we think it is or is not in violation of some understanding or agreement.
With respect to foreign trade, more and more all the time as the economy has become skewered, they become more protectionist. We are not any different than some of these other countries, but the reality of the situation is, whether it is militarily, whether it is trade, whether it is supportive of other nations through foreign aid and support, America, or the United States, not having had a colonial empire, we do not have a unique historical relationship with other parts of the world. Our relationships primarily, other than this continent, have been built as a result of military escapades that our Nation had been about, where we befriended individuals afterwards and they befriended us, and we have gone on to become immense allies.
I think this resolution is a great idea, I applaud you and the others for introducing it and cosponsoring it. I think anything that can be done to move forward, to continue to move forward, to try to understand other people's positions is incredibly important, but I also think the reality of the situation is, we will continue to live in a more and more isolated world all the time, as people look within for the support that they need around the world and look without for the material support that they need to move forward with their political agendas.
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And so I think anything that can be done to continue a dialogue, especially in a world as hostile and dangerous as this is, not fearing land armies, not fearing invasions, but fearing what can be done utilizing technology and commitments of individuals who are basically of a suicidal nature means, really, civilized people of the world, all of them, need to figure out how to work together better, work together more effectively, more efficiently, and really improve the well-being of us here on Earth and those in the future.
Thank you.
Mr. BEREUTER. Thank you, Governor.
Are there further opening statements?
I see none, but Mr. Wexler, do you want to be recognized?
Mr. WEXLER. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
If I could make a suggestion, to the extent that Members of this Subcommittee have not had an opportunity to look at the German Marshall Fund, if we could provide that to the Members of the Committee, I think that would be a fascinating thing for people to read, to get a better understanding of the view of Europeans toward the United States and vice versa. But I think what is most telling is the view of Europeans of us; and I think we all could learn a great deal from us not putting it in partisan terms. But we have a huge perception problem that goes beyond government-to-government relations.
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Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. BEREUTER. I think it is a good idea, and as a matter of fact, we will do that. I remember the one thing that stood out on that report that is absolutely shocking to me is that one out of three Germans polled under the age of 30 believed that the United States was directly complicit or caused the attack on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon on 9/11. It is just incredible.
Mr. DELAHUNT. Would the gentleman yield for a moment?
Mr. BEREUTER. Pardon?
Yes, I will yield.
Mr. DELAHUNT. I mean, this is kind of a relaxed markup, and I think that we are having more of a conversation than we normally do. I would concur with the request and just note that the President himself, according to newspaper reports, was really taken aback on his trip to Asia by what he saw as the attitude of Muslim leaders in terms of their understanding and their perception of the United States' true intentions.
Now, we all have been active in political life, otherwise we wouldn't be here, and we know that oftentimes there is a great disparity between perception and reality. But again, perception, when you're not talking with folk, becomes their reality.
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And also let me again further throw a cue toward the Chairman about these interparliamentary conferences.
Obviously, government-to-government relationships in many ways fill out and define our foreign policy, but my own experience in Latin America has been in interparliamentary conferences, relationships are incredibly important in terms of understanding each other. So that perception becomes more accurate, whatever it may be, and it does change, shift.
And I can, you know, spend hours relating what good results have occurred because of the efforts of Cass Ballenger in Latin America, along with Bob Menendez and others, in terms of creating interparliamentary relationships that, I think in some cases, might very well have avoided serious problems for the United States.
So I think these things are all important. And you, Mr. Chairman, as a senior Member of the Full Committee, who is highly respected on both sides, I think that putting forth a request for this Committee to be polled about attitudes, whether they be in Europe or elsewhere on the globe is something that should be considered and should be reflected upon.
You mentioned Germany. When the Irish Independent, the paper of record in Ireland, does a poll that is published, pre-Iraq war, that says the majority of people in Ireland considered George Bush more of a threat to world peace than Saddam Hussein, we have got some serious problems; and this is what we better start to deal with.
I yield back and thank the gentleman.
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Mr. BEREUTER. Thank you.
The gentleman from Massachusetts, I will get to you in a second, and I just want to commend you for the work that you yourself do in Latin America. I think it is a major contribution.
The gentleman from Michigan.
Mr. MCCOTTER. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. This is a very informal setting.
I would first like to cite your work on this resolution. I think it is very kind, especially in light of the European Parliament resolution which I read, which they offered to us.
I think that when we deal with perception, delicate words are nice, but concrete deeds are more important, and so when we hear about the numbers of people, perhaps in Germany or somewhere else that may think United States was complicitous on September 11, I believe that they are people beyond redemption. I believe that we should not have the time of day to spend with them, even more than the Germans who created the Holocaust. I think that if they think we did this to our own people, to hell with them; and I will not let their perception of America, defending themselves, influence America any more than we absolutely have to.
In terms of France, that is fine. You know, we have a long history with them. I have said it before, but they had an empire, they had an empire. I am an Irish Catholic. I know that Britain had an empire. I do not want to hear that we are a threat to world peace, and we want to control anybody. If that was true, if I worried about that perception, I would point out that Paris is currently France's national capital, where maybe after World War I or World War II, Paris would be France's State capital if we were so inclined. But we were not; we buried our dead and left.
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It should never inhibit our duty in those areas. So I appreciate your resolution; I will vote for it. I will bite my tongue now and vote for it.
Mr. BEREUTER. Thank you very much, Mr. McCotter.
In our judgment, our prime responsibility is to—at least to our national interest; and the thing that concerns me most about that particular group that you're referring to in Germany, by your description, is that unfortunately they have an influence on others who are uninformed or who are still in a juvenile—literally juveniles, and so they can do great damage.
If there are no further opening comments?
Mr. BLUMENAUER. I will bide my time.
Mr. BEREUTER. You do not have to. We rarely get a chance to talk to each other in what I think is a proper fashion.
Are there any amendments to the resolution?
Seeing none, then the Chair will now entertain a motion that the resolution be reported favorably to the Full Committee.
Thank you.
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Mr. JANKLOW. So move.
Mr. BEREUTER. The request occurs on the motion to report the resolution, H. Res. 390, favorably.
All in favor, say aye.
All opposed, no.
The motion is approved. The bill is reported favorably.
Without objection, the bill will be reported favorably to the Full Committee. I would simply ask staff to make any technical and conforming amendments.
Without objection, hearing no objection, that will be the order.
I thank my colleagues for their time today and the interest in the resolution; and anyone who would like to be a cosponsor can certainly join in that effort before we move the bill from the room today.
Mr. WEXLER. Thanks.
Mr. BEREUTER. The Subcommittee is adjourned.
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Time for lunch.
[Whereupon, at 1:39 p.m., the Subcommittee was adjourned.]